Ever since Final Fantasy VII made RPGs popular in the mainstream, everyone has been wanting to slap the title of RPG on everything, even if their game is not an RPG. Nintendo to my knowledge, has not ever called Zelda an RPG, but it doesn’t keep a legion of fans calling it an "action RPG". To my knowledge, there is no example of a true "action RPG". [ 1 ]
First, let’s look at what an RPG is. An RPG is a role-playing-game. The mechanics of an RPG are designed to mimic those of tabletop RPGs such as Dungeons and Dragons. In the common RPG model, your characters get experience points to level up, which causes a change in their stats. These stats are then used to determine the results of the character’s actions. For example, your skill with a sword along with the quality of a monster’s armor determines if you hit something.
Secondly, let’s look at what Zelda really is : an action-adventure game.
Classic adventure games didn’t feature much action. They relied on a key-based model. You found a "key" and you used that to get to the next area in the game. The key could be anything, a scrap of meat to get past the rabid poodles or the Eye of Magjibin which unlocks the secret pyramid door. These keys were usually involved in some kind of puzzle to make it more challenging and entertaining than just picking up a key and unlocking a door.
Action games are based on the idea of using force to advance in the game. You have a gun, a sword, or a zombie arm to pound the enemies into submission and advance to the next level. Advancing in the game requires hand-eye-coordination rather than a random number generator weighted by stats. For example, it would be silly to hit a enemy with a bullet in Contra and see "miss" floating above it’s head.
The hybrid game, the action-adventure game is primarily a action game with adventure elements. The best two examples are Zelda and Metriod. Both Zelda and Metroid are primarily action games. You could get through both games without getting more hearts or energy tanks if you were really good. The adventure element takes the form of what I call ''ability keys''.
Ability keys are keys that give the player some ability which allows them to advance in the game. You get a double jump, which allows you to get up on a new platform that leads to a new area. You get a hookshot, which allows you to get from one platform to the next. Or you get bombs or missiles which open a certain kind of door.
Never does Link go up a level, never does he “miss” even though you hit an enemy with a sword.
And there you have it. Zelda is NOT an RPG.
No, actually, believe it or not, that's not the end of the issue. This article has become a trilogy. Sadly, it's needed. The next article in the series, not surprisingly is : Zelda is NOT an RPG II
[ 1 ] There may be one example in the Castlevania series beginning with Castlevania: Symphony of the Night. I haven't played this game in years and will have to play it again to be sure. However, I'm pretty sure that if you were good enough you could progress without leveling up.
[ sidenote ] Since first publishing this article about The Legend of Zelda, I've found that there is a group people who swear to their holy grandmothers left toenail that Zelda is, without a doubt, an RPG. Then, there is a second group who believes that the first group must be kidding.
What's interesting here is how these groups are typically divided. If a person was too young to remember when The Legend of Zelda was first released or don't know what EGA/CGA graphics are, chances are they fall into the first group. People old enough to have remembered the original gold cartridge as well as the Gold Box Series, tend to fall into the second group.
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| Categories: Articles : RPG : Video Game Genres |
The Diablo series made by Blizzard is, in my opinion, the best of the very few action RPGs. You have to click on things to move and attack, which requires hand eye coordination as well as speed, but if your dexterity stat is low enough, you can miss. It also has characteristics of many RPGS, such as advancing levels get new spells/abilities, mana, stats. It is impossible to get very far in the game without leveling up, because you wouldn't be powerful enough to kill any of the later enemies before they killed you. A few others are Hellgate London, The Shining Souls series (GBA), and The Elder Scrolls series (Morowind, Oblivion, etc.) If you haven't played Diablo (preferably Diablo II. it's much better than the original), I suggest you play it before you claim that there is no such thing as an action RPG.
I support you that Zelda is not an RPG. It is an adventure game with abilities and lots of NPCs.
Note about Castlevania: In my opinion, all of the Castlevanias are adventure games, much like Zelda. They do have stats, mana, levels, and other RPG-ish things, but the combat is still based completely on whether or not the weapon sprite touched the enemy sprite, and successful spell casting is based on button combonations rather than a magic skill stat.
You are absolutely right :) I have missed in after a collision in the Diablo series. Thank you. :)
— Shawn
Hee Hartnell,
First of all, great article, I would like to use it in my thesis but it's lacking of source material. How do you come up with ability-keys, force, etc. Did you written any papers(or something similiar) about this? Please contact me: mail (AT) michielkrol.nl
Thnx!
Thanks for the comments. No, I haven't written anything except what's here on GDN. Wikis are how I publish.
I think force is obvious. I may have coined the term "ability-key", the concept hit me after remembering something I've already forgotten again. I think it was a puzzle in the monkey island series where a key item was a steak you had to toss to some "rabid poodles" and I thought, "What if the key item had been boots, and gave the player object the ability to jump over the poodles, and any other similar obstacle," and then the tie in with Metriod hit me instantly. Ability-Key. :)
— hartnell
I agree with the conclusion but not with the reasoning
I'm curious, what reasoning lead you to the same conclusion?
— hartnell
What about kingdom hearts? a bunch of people say it's an action RPG, still you get level-ups and new skills…
and Fable,! this is most likely the best example of action-rpg's
I would say it is indeed a great example, but i must say, Diablo 3 looks like a much better Action-RPG, but we will see when Blizz-con is going on, can't wait for it. I won't be going, but i will be checking the internet when it is going on, most likely G4, gamespot, and actiontrip. I bet they will gives its release date. Hartnell, if you get Diablo 2, you will like it i think.
I see what you mean about Ability-Key though. Just an ability that lets you get past an area, very smart name i must say, never would have thought of it (im not being sarcastic, i'm serious).
if you mean Dragon Fable when you say "Fable", to the best of my belief, Dragon Fable is not an Action RPG. Action RPGs are game in which reflexes are more important then strategy, and this is never true in Turn-Based games such as Dragon Fable. By the way, I totally agree that Zelda is Not an RPG and have mentioned it in the article that I made by request, Wtf is an RPG. If this title is inapropriate, please inform me immediately.
CaptainLepidus
I think he ment Fable as in the game for xbox and then Fable 2 for xbox 360.
No, Fable is a computer game in which you can marry people and you run around doing quests. Its not turn-based either.
Zelda IS an RPG.
Your argument seems to be "If you ignore the ways it is like an RPG, and pretend that certain things about it are like certain things in adventure games, it is more like an adventure game". 'Ability Keys' is something you made up, besides which the facility to learn new abilities and gain new equipment for your character is an RPG characteristic, not an adventure one.
Zelda has stats. If you beat a boss, you get a bonus to max HP. Admittedly, it's very stats-light, but it's not stats-free.
It is nothing like an adventure game. Adventure games are things like Monkey Island, or Kings Quest. In Zelda there is no real inventory, just a graphic representation of a list of which weapons you have unlocked, as well as any spells you have learned. You cannot use collected items for anything other than combat, you do not find items to solve puzzles with unless the puzzle is 'How do I navigate this dungeon'.
Speaking of which, IT HAS A SERIES OF DUNGEONS YOU NEED TO CLEAR IN ORDER TO FACE THE FINAL BOSS. That describes every RPG ever created. It doesn't describe an adventure game.
There is no interactive dialogue. You get talked to at certain points, but you just scroll through. You cannot choose a dialogue option from a list, or solve puzzles through dialogue, like you can in an adventure game.
An example of an 'action adventure' game would be Farenheit. Puzzles to solve, branching dialogue. No collecting new weapons, no increasing stats, just puzzles and dialogue, with action sequences.
Zelda has stats and combat - it is an RPG. A very watered down RPG for kids with minimal stats, but still an RPG.
i disagree with you regarding the HP. Zelda hearts, or 'HP', are more like arcade style lives(such as in Kirby), than RPG hit points.
The dungeons are also not really dungeons. They are not much more than 3D versions of levels(such as in Super Mario Bros).
RPGs have interactive text(sometimes). In fact, an RPG is more likely to have interactive text than an Adventure Game.
WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT PLOT! ONLY ABOUT GAME MECHANICS!
In RPGs, the inventory is not just a 'graphic representation' of the weapons you have unlocked!
You know back in the Days of D&D and then AD&D it is considered a RPG for a few things;
1. You character became strong and gained certains skills/stats through the experience you got through the adventuring.
2. You collected items that enhanced your abilities making you harder to kill or for you to kill faster.
3. You wandered around and visited new realms, explored cavern's, town's, forests etc…
4. You could either solo (yes tere were some solo campaigns) or have a group of adventurers with you.
5. You fought mythical creatures, some of which were directly created by J.R. Tolken, for those that don't know is the father of fantasy, dragons and the books "Lord of the Rings"
6. You were hired by locals to get rid of pesty creatures, save a person or retrieve an item.
7. You were to figure out some type of Riddle/puzzle. You may need to figure out how to get across that gorge and what around you or in your inventory was needed to accomplish that.
A true RPG does not have to have all of these elements in them, They can have some or some symbolance of them within. An rpg is all about playing a ROLE in a GAME to which the object is to adventure and become stronger. Zelda had this as well as Dragon Warrior (Dragon quest on the Famicon[sp?]), Final Fantasy, diablo etc…
This whole argument demonstrates the problem with categorising games (and most other things): categories are fluid.
It's particularly bad with game genres because every individual has a set of criteria that they think defines each genre, based on what other games they've played from the genre before, but which might differ from what anyone else thinks, and at the same time they're all convinced that there is a universal set of rules about what defines the genre, that those rules are the same as their opinions, and that anyone who doesn't use the same rules is ignorant.
This is not a universal definition of the RPG:
"An RPG is a role-playing-game. The mechanics of an RPG are designed to mimic those of tabletop RPGs such as Dungeons and Dragons. In the common RPG model, your characters get experience points to level up, which causes a change in their stats. These stats are then used to determine the results of the character’s actions."
The common argument that "all games involve role-playing" might be annoying and obtuse, but it has a point: there are innumerable activities that could be called "role-playing games", and all(?) videogames are among them, and the "RPG" label for the specific videogame genre came about gradually, loosely and informally. Therefore, any hard-and-fast rules about what qualifies an RPG are based only on what you're used to thinking. Of course, if we could get everyone to agree on a definition then we could use it freely, but since we can't (cf. this entire page) there's no point being prescriptive about it.
Hence my proposed new title for this page:
Zelda IS or ISN'T or MIGHT BE an RPG depending on your definition, what you've played before and what your friends think
@
Anonymous: I'm sorry, I can't follow your reasoning; why isn't the definition you quoted universal? And how can the classification of games be dependent on what the player experienced befored, what he might think is the answer (and I'm having trouble dealing with this statement), and, even more (and forgive me, but I have to admit — this one really made me laugh), on what his friends think?!
I stayed on the side line on this ongoing argument, simply because I wasn't familiar with the Zelda game (or the series rather). But after watching a few gameplay demos on YouTube, I'm inclined to say that this game has too much emphasis on action, and practically none on character development, to fall in the category of what is commonly accepted as an RPG.
To be frank, I cannot understand why some of the individuals posting here are defending so fiercely one point of view or the other, like their own life or good name is at stake in it. People, chill out ! What does it matter to you what category a game falls in, as long as you still enjoy it?! It just doesn't make sense to go on a verbal rampage over this…
I'm going to drop a "party pooper bomb." Does it matter whether or not Zelda is an action game or RPG? (impactz plz) :D (Yes, I said this because I'm too lazy to say anything of more substance.)
From a game programming / game design perspective … you bet your cheezeburger it does.
From a causal player's point of view, not really.
— hartnell
Put me down for two McCheeze!
Mmmm.. McCheeziees. :)
— hartnell
I'll take three.(buy) But I won't bet any.
You have a point hartnell. (thus you gave an impact :))
Yeah, Zelda is an RPG.
hehe someone is fishing ;)
Guys, this is coming from a Game Freak & Game Programmer. So please understand that whether Zelda is an RPG means the world, and yet means nothing at all to me.
First of all, there is no way to 'miss' in zelda, there is no real developement going on. There are no status attacks, and you can't control any other characters in the game. And to add insult to injury, there is no 'Ultimate attack' to learn.
Now all of that is debatable as to whether it is a requirement in an RPG to begin with. I say that because, like all things, Games are developing beyond what we knew back when the term RPG was created (this is back in 1991 if I remember correctly). Now, i will take each point on its own and discuss them as I know them to be.
There is no 'miss'. This is also true for Fable (Xbox/Xbox360), yet Fable *IS* an RPG, albeit an Action RPG. However, in terms of the CLASSIC RPG, then there is ALWAYS a calculation as to wether you miss or hit.
Character developement. Well, sorry, there is no arguement to really put here. There is no 'developement' in the character known as Link. There is only acquisition of new weapons and tools, and that is TOTALLY against RPG rules. In that respect Zelda is no different to getting a new hat in Mario 64, getting a new weapon in Halo, or getting the final smash in Smash brothers. This doesn't make Zelda a bad series, but it doesn't make it an RPG either.
Status attacks. Every RPG I have ever played, even the home-brew, had status attacks. These were used to give more of a realistic tone to the game. Though they were not very damaging, they were annoying as hell to deal with if you were not prepared. Zelda, as series (yes I have played most, if not all titles of the series), does not have this element.
Controlling other characters. There are quite a few RPG's that do not follow this golden rule, but they have a balance to it. To start with, RPG's where you only conrtol 1 character, are always RPG's that let's you design the character yourself. In every Zelda game (the seagull in Windwaker does not count), you only control Link (or whatever his name would be in that version) and you cannot change how he looks (changing his shirt in Ocarina of time, does not constitute changing the character).
The ultimate attack. There is no 'Ultima', no Level 30 required skill, no acquire more items before unlocking… or anything else in that range. There are 'attacks' that you can unlock in various game titles under the Zelda title, but none of them become powerful enough to call Ultimate.
In conclusion, especially after the introduction of Ocerina of Time, the Zelda series has become less and less like the RPG people claim it to be, and more and more like a FPS/Action/Adventure game. (FPS, as in using the bow and shooting it in First Person View, don't argue with me!) Does any of this make Zelda titles any less fun or adictive? Not a chance! I am every bit as addicted to Twighlight Princess as I am to Ocerina of Time, or even to a Link to the Past. But this doesn't make the title an RPG. Sorry guys.
Ever looked at Legend of Zelda 2 if you do that proves legend of zelda is a RPG! Infact this whole article is so vague that if you were to point out the platformer-rpg Zelda 2 than it can be said that Zelda is a RPG. This article is not specific enough.
The problem seems to be your reading skill.
This is what happens in Zelda 2 :
This is what happens in an actual RPG: Whether or not there is a collision registered, the following math is done :
And that's the basics. I'm not going into how an 'attack stat' or 'defense against damage rating' is calculated. You simply wouldn't be able to handle the math.
This is why you play games and not make them.
— hartnell